Ladies and Gentlemen,
Several young men have written about to wanting to leave Singapore to avoid national service; wanting to know what would happen if they left Singapore without serving.
Many dislike having to lose out 2 or 3 years of their life in running around the bush away from education, feeling they are disadvantaged compared to those who went to university without interruption. Personally my view is that national service for what it is, is good; it keeps you fit, inculcates independence and self reliance; but the decision is yours on what you do.
In other words, it stops you from being a Mambino, Italian for Mamma's Boy.
Firstly, your refusal to do national service will not be grounds to receive asylum or refugee status abroad. That is quite clear from the legal precedents so far on asylum and refugee law.
The good news is, Singapore will not succeed in any application to extradite you to Singapore and furthermore any foreign government faced with an extradition request for an national service deserter will most probably not send you back.
Furthermore I suspect there are certain offenses, usually the serious ones, where extradition is applied for. Even for a country that really lacks the rule of law and any fair and just legal system like Singapore, they probably still will not commence extradition proceedings for national service absconders.
Also, even in the unlikely event that Singapore applied for extradition, the person is not sent back automatically. He is first given a hearing before the foreign court at which time you will raise the reasons why you don't want to be returned; such as lack of democracy in Singapore, lack of human rights, dictatorial rule, no rule of law etc. The courts in the free countries of the world, unlike Singapore, are independent and with Singapore now having a very bad name as an authoritarian intolerant country, you would almost certainly win your case.
But the downside is, Singapore, under the Enlistment Act will arrest and charge you if you ever return to Singapore, regardless of which country's citizenship you hold. Therefore, if you avoided national service and left Singapore, you would never be able to return to Singapore at all; it is so to speak, a life sentence.
For many, this is an unbearable punishment; as they have parents, relatives and family members in Singapore. To some extent now, I am in this position myself, although not for national service reasons.
Since leaving Singapore last November, I had deliberately written some blogs criticizing another High Court judge in Singapore as well as deliberately committed contempt of court of Judge Leslie Chew's order to remove some blog posts, by re posting them. So, it would appear that I could be arrested and sent to jail if ever I returned to Singapore. But in my case, it does not matter much. I wanted to make a point that no one could stop me from exercising my rights as a man, and second, I no longer have any relatives in Singapore.
Singapore's interests has much to gain by me criticising Singapore's dictatorial government since it exposes the truth of Singapore to the world. My inability to return to Singapore is surely a very small price to pay.
If you can, my advice is to serve national service. At least it will make you a little fitter, than the sissys that I find among the Singaporeans. After that, get out of the country and write a letter to Lee Kuan Yew's son and give him a piece of your mind.
Gopalan Nair
39737 Paseo Padre Parkway, Suite A1
Fremont, CA 94538, USA
Tel: 510 657 6107
Fax: 510 657 6914
Email: nair.gopalan@yahoo.com
Blog: http://singaporedissident.blogspot.com/
Your letters are welcome. We reserve the right to publish your letters. Please Email your letters to nair.gopalan@yahoo.com And if you like what I write, please tell your friends. You will be helping democracy by distributing this widely. This blog not only gives information, it dispels government propaganda put out by this dictatorial regime.
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35 comments:
Correction Mr Nair, NS is not about "having to lose out 2 or 3 years of their life", it is much more than that.
Considering the ICT, it is much much more than that.
Well then, why don't you say what it is?
With all due respect I'd gladly stay in Singapore and complete the conscription if it weren't for the people around me (in the army or out of). They are living in perpetual fear! I told them about this blog and how the government is reigning control over us and not one bit the other way. They commonly responded with a "walls have ears" or "Just do it, no choice". You'd think after 6 months in the army I'd become one of them, I am proud to say I have not; but I am afraid of contemplating what I'd be like after two years in the army (and this is why people cannot remain). You should also know that they are trying ban websites now.
I suppose he is saying In Camp Training (ICT) where males have to commit their precious time every year, at the expense of their jobs.
This is also why FTs are preferred over Singaporeans males because of no job disruption.
he did...
Considering the ICT, it is much much more than that.
While I do agree with you that leaving Singapore after NS is a better option for those intending to return, I can't say I share your 'enthusiasm' about NS.
You keep mentioning in this and earlier posts that NS turns sissys into tougher men and that it's not a big deal. Perhaps this is to motivate those writing to you about skipping NS to take the wiser route of completing it first before making decisions about jumping ship.
If it isn't though, I can't see why someone who fully supports the freedom of speech and choice to be a proponent of this system. It's not just 2 years of tough and physically beneficial training. The 3-month Basic Military Training phase may be a little fun but what comes after is akin to working for a heavy handed dictator. Punishments aplenty and many rights being taken away for no other reason other than it being the law.
Compulsory reservist duties, where we run through jungles for weeks a year, and annual mobilizations where we lug a few days worth of military supplies to a camp for inspection are also disruptive to our professional lives and frankly a little demeaning.
An older guy I met in reservist once told me that he was surprised that after being called back after 10 years, the Army still hasn't learned how to truly motivate men towards the goals of NS, whatever those may be. It was just something we were told to do because of the law.
It will be great to know your honest views on NS Mr. Nair and why you're sometimes in favour of it for example. As a regular visitor to your blog, I find this confusing.
Gopalan, as much as I respect you and your courage to stand up against the Singapore government and say what is right, I must disagree on your stand about NS. I think it is a poor generalization to classify all who want to dodge NS as "sissies". This whole "boy-to-man" bullshit is nothing but PAP propaganda, and I can't believe you are buying it! Why should Singaporeans take the crap of wasting 2-3 years of our lives when people in civilized developed countries are free to pursue their education and career at this prime of their life? NS is slavery, no matter how you look at it. If the Singapore government threw you in jail and justified "hey it's going to help you lose some weight", do you think you would buy it?
I'm sorry but your point "Singapore, under the Enlistment Act will arrest and charge you if you ever return to Singapore, regardless of which country's citizenship you hold" simply doesn't make sense.
If I dump my citizenship and come back on a foreign passport, on what jurisdiction does the Singapore government has to arrest me? Who gives them the right to arrest people that are not Singapore citizens, since the law only apply to Singapore citizens? Perhaps you could clarify this?
To the Anonymous,
Why serve ICT? ICT is the real disruptive interruption to your work and civilian life.
Esp when you are happily enjoying
Sun off when they recall you back to camp to fight of imaginery enemies.
What I meant to say was, take the 2years as an extended excursion. Have fun. Learn to shoot a rifle. Toughen yourself in body and spirit. And after that, say thanks to the Emperor and leave Singapore for good. Live in Australia, New Zealand, Canada or come to Fremont, California if you like.
But don't forget the injustices that go on there. Keep doing what you can to expose the rot.
There are some benefits to NS surely. What about discipline? Punctuality? Responsibility?
Hi Gopalan
I have a brother-in-law who went to Australia to study and did not go back to Singapore to do National Service. He stayed on in Australia and married an Australian, and thereafter became an Australian citizen himself.
Then he went back to Singapore to visit his parents and siblings a several times, using his Australian Passport. Nothing happened to him. No arrest. No charge.
That was between 1973 to 1986. After that he stopped going back to Singapore because by 1998 all his siblings and parents had also migrated to Australia via his sponsorship.
On anther point, if Singaporeans who absconded from the National Service are not able to go back to Singapore because of the fear of being arrested, they can always arrange for their parents to meet them in Johore, just across the Causeway - just only a little bit of inconvenience. Food for thought.
Regards and cheers.
To anonymous of Nov 22, 0758,
It may not make sense to you but it certainly does to Lee Kuan Yew's Singapore. I am sure you have heard of the Singaporean muscician Melvyn Tan case in 2005 or so. He was a UK citizen. They still charged and convicted him.
The way they look at it is this. It is their law in their island. And if they catch you in it, they will get you. Simple as that.
My advice again, if you are in this situation, stay out of Singapore forever.
The jail term can extend up to 3 years and their judges have instructions to up the sentence the older you are.
They are shooting temselves in the foot becasue those who have been banished in this way are in fact the very ones Singapore needs the most.
For my cause here, this law is an advantage. It helps spread the message far and wide.
Are you implying that men in countries like Australia, New Zealand, Canada or Fremont, California have absolutely no sense of discipline, punctuality or responsibility (or that they're all sissies?) because there's no full time national service in those places?
You know better than that Mr. N, the liabilities outweigh the benefits to the common man.
Singapore can do with full time armed forces (like in America), well paid people who want to be career soldiers and scrap the National Service B.S aka slavery for chickpeas (sorry peanuts is taken).
For once the cun*s will be creating real jobs for the locals.
You would agree with me that for 2 years a conscriptee is required to work full time. You know as well as I do that this is not 'office hours' full time! So shouldn't he be paid a full time salary for his full time commitment?
Would YOU work for $2 an hour in Singapore in the current economic climate in Singapore?
Having said that, all the gentlemen who are having thoughts of doing something life changing, please listen. Get out while you still can, while you're still young enough, before your commitments tie you down, for once you're settled elsewhere you can bring your family there as well. BUT do it the LAWFUL way (as in the administrative sense for it's common knowledge that Singapore has no real law).
DO NOT under any circumstances run away for like Mr N said, you may never ever return even for a holiday or to visit someone.
Apply for PR in another country from Singapore, when you get it get your exit permit and move. Get your foreign citizenship then renounce you Singapore citizenship. That's the only way for most of you.
Do all of this AFTER your primary 2 years obligation. If not anything else, it would teach you that YOU CAN SURVIVE ANYWHERE. And you will too for pretty much anywhere offers a better life than Singapore can.
I took the wrong path, so believe me.
Cheers.
Nate
If there is an issue that you are not sure of please refrain from giving any advice. NS in this case, under the Leegime, is not about national security, but to give his 2 precious sons, LHL & HSH, to play war games at the expense of the people's life. There is no value in working life to know how to shoot a rifle or throw a grenade.
NS to the Leegime has different agenda. To the Lee, NS is a double edge sword for him to constrain real Singaporean men from forming an alternate party to dig out, expose and dismiss all the wrong policy he had made.
Before he is going to the grave (sooner if not later given his over due, extended and borrowed life) he is starting now to admit many wrong things he have done in the past such as forcing 3 millions Singaporeans to learn bilingual languages.
Perhaps he can't die with all his guilty conscious and take it with him inside into his coffin. The sign of his death is showing and coming soon as the Chinese believe when an older person is about to die soon they will do say and do strange things that surprises his family. These things are usually things he/she wants to do in his life time but fail to do so and his conscious are haunting him.
Perhaps we would be expecting the Emperor to apologises more to the nation before he finally up-the-lorry soon .... hehehehe
Anonymous said...
"If there is an issue that you are not sure of please refrain from giving any advice."
Typical Han Chinese reaction. A compliant and obedient group. They and the Lee (Li?) dynasty are made for each other.
He/she spoils the rest of the comments with this crap.
Mr. Nair,
You should spend some time getting to know 18 year old's from USA, Australia, Britain. You will soon realise how weak/indecisive/limited 18 year old males from Singapore are.
At 18, most kids in the USA/Aust/UK leave home, learn to make decisions, have fun, develop opinions, make mistakes, get into trouble... Many develop good communications and people skills along the way.
The result is that in their 20's, they are capable of formulating cogent ideas or even building great companies, e.g Microsoft, Google, Yahoo, Youtube. They may not have the best grades or marks.
But, in their 30 and 40's, they are the one tapped to become VPs and CEO.
The one anomaly to this thesis, are the number of Indian CEO's in the USA. Very few Chinese make this grade. Indian's speak their minds, something which American's value. The Chinese come across as being mysterious - good for engineering tasks, but no skills for managing people.
To reply to Mr Nair's claim on the merits of NS, "There are some benefits to NS surely. What about discipline? Punctuality? Responsibility?"
I think such desirable qualities can be learnt elsewhere besides in National Slavery. If it takes slavery to teach one discipline, punctuality and responsibility, then that is extremely SAD indeed. I would argue that NS teaches none of these alleged qualities. All NS does is indoctrinate you, turn you into a mindless slave... so on the outside you may appear to have discipline but on the side, there is nothing but indoctrination and fear of being thrown into DB. Real desirable qualities come from within the person, and not from some oppressive organization!
Btw as an ex National Slave, I can say that I have had discipline, punctuality and responsibility BEFORE I was conscripted against my will. NS has taught me *nothing*, except for fueling my passion of getting out of this stinking country!
In developed civilized countries at 18 years old, kids go off to college and learn to live on their own. They learn how to take care of themselves, get an apartment, get a job, manage their finances, etc... That to me, is a better way to transform from "boy-to-man". Even after glorified National Slavery, how many Singaporean guys are can live independently, manage their finances, mortgage and stuff? Oh no... Singaporean men still live with their mommy and daddy! High HDB prices and inability to purchase housing as a single being one of the issues that make the matter worse.
To those who commented on doing it the "lawful" way, i.e. serve as a slave then leave Singapore think again.
Do this:
1) Refuse conscription, make plans to get out of the country before it hits you. Best option is to get a tertiary education overseas.
2) Get PR. In places like Canada and Australia and UK, getting PR is quite easy after you graduate and work there for a while.
3) Get citizenship.
4) Sponsor your family over.
Miss your family?
1) Why on earth do you need to return to Sinkapore to see your family? Another trait of the inflexible Singaporean mind.
2) Instead, why not meet your family at some place and go on a tour together? Worst case meet at JB. Problem solved.
3) Skype, webcam, you get the idea. Sure, it may not be the same as personal contact, but consider this conundrum. In stressful Singapore, you have no time for your family. In other places, you may have time for time. In many cases, I have found that people who go overseas actually keep in contact with their family MORE often than if they were in Singapore! What's the point of being geographically close to your family if you won't have time for them?
I agree with 'Anonymous Mon Nov 23, 08:37:00 PM PST'. Serving NS has done little for me except to fuel my deep desire to leave Singapore.
If NS was really responsible for all the good Singapore has achieved over the years, we would bloody be appreciated afterwards with free education or at least a $10,000 dollar tax rebate for life instead of such flimsy benefits like an extra $400 salary that our dear PM keep's proclaiming (which only Government jobs guarantee btw). This was actually something which I and many others believed when we were serving. Shame on us I guess.
As for leaving this country, I have to say that NS has somewhat slowed me down due to the 2 years wasted. Unlike many brats who think leaving Singapore is as easy as begging their moms and dads for money to study overseas, many of us actually don't have the luxury of leaving before NS. (READ: Anonymous - Mon Nov 23, 08:43:00 PM PST) We need to work and study here to save up while applying for work visas in actual democracies. I guess I have no right to complain considering the millions of third-world country citizens who are doing pretty much the same thing.
Nevertheless, life IS hard in Singapore for the average male citizen without a few hundred thousand lying around and NS makes it even tougher on us. With more reservist-free non-citizens who require lower CPF contributions and their lower expected salaries in general, what chance do we have but to set our sights overseas.
So go ahead Straits Times editors, haul more insults our way about how we're not competitive enough or too mollycoddled by our cushy upbringings in Singapore. You’re just spurring greater numbers of us to start packing our bags.
Anonymous said...
To those who commented on doing it the "lawful" way, i.e. serve as a slave then leave Singapore think again.
Do this:
1) Refuse conscription, make plans to get out of the country before it hits you. Best option is to get a tertiary education overseas.
2) Get PR. In places like Canada and Australia and UK, getting PR is quite easy after you graduate and work there for a while.
3) Get citizenship.
4) Sponsor your family over.
Unfortunately, you're advice is rubbish. Do it yourself before giving your 2 cents.
1) To leave before NS liability you got to be 12. Once you're 16 or over your exit permit may be refused. Gov's not stupid to let young people off without conscripting. If you did get off you will be required to go back to serve NS or look below.
2) If you left anyways, without an exit permit, criminal charges may be brought against you as a NS deserter. Instead of trying you in a military tribunal, these days, the matter is referred to the police and magistrates courts. Therefore you become wanted in Singapore and when convicted your record is tarnished. Therefore you cant get a Certificate of No Criminal Convictions from CID for your foreign PR application. Remember your tertiary education will be of next to no use to you now.
3) It is not true that applying for a PR in a western country is as easy now as it is in Singapore for the PRCs. Just having studied and worked in a country will not be enough. For example Australia has announced recently that it will cut down 30,000 immigration applications a year. Applications require extensive paperwork to be filed and may still be rejected due to quota being met that year.
I stand by what I said, do it but do it the smart way. Whoever this clown that gave his 2 cents at the top, he's not fit to advice. I've been through it the way that he recommends. It was not pretty. Now I dont live in or miss Singapore, but neither am I allowed to step foot in Singapore. Whether or not I'm a foreign citizen makes no difference to LKY's law.
DO YOUR RESEARCH, TAKE THE SAFEST APPROACH AND BEST OF LUCK.
Cheers
Nate
Anonymous said...
To those who commented on doing it the "lawful" way, i.e. serve as a slave then leave Singapore think again.
Do this:
1) Refuse conscription, make plans to get out of the country before it hits you. Best option is to get a tertiary education overseas.
2) Get PR. In places like Canada and Australia and UK, getting PR is quite easy after you graduate and work there for a while.
3) Get citizenship.
4) Sponsor your family over.
Unfortunately, you're advice is rubbish. Do it yourself before giving your 2 cents.
1) To leave before NS liability you got to be 12. Once you're 16 or over your exit permit may be refused. Gov's not stupid to let young people off without conscripting. If you did get off you will be required to go back to serve NS or look below.
2) If you left anyways, without an exit permit, criminal charges may be brought against you as a NS deserter. Instead of trying you in a military tribunal, these days, the matter is referred to the police and magistrates courts. Therefore you become wanted in Singapore and when convicted your record is tarnished. Therefore you cant get a Certificate of No Criminal Convictions from CID for your foreign PR application. Remember your tertiary education will be of next to no use to you now.
3) It is not true that applying for a PR in a western country is as easy now as it is in Singapore for the PRCs. Just having studied and worked in a country will not be enough. For example Australia has announced recently that it will cut down 30,000 immigration applications a year. Applications require extensive paperwork to be filed and may still be rejected due to quota being met that year.
I stand by what I said, do it but do it the smart way. Whoever this clown that gave his 2 cents at the top, he's not fit to advice. I've been through it the way that he recommends. It was not pretty. Now I dont live in or miss Singapore, but neither am I allowed to step foot in Singapore. Whether or not I'm a foreign citizen makes no difference to LKY's law.
DO YOUR RESEARCH, TAKE THE SAFEST APPROACH AND BEST OF LUCK.
Cheers
Nate
wow...so many unhappy SE pple ya..m wondering, what make u pple stay on..GO LAR..TALK SO MUCH! talk all bad things abt SE & NS,if u r married, teach that to ur children lar,if u clever, then leave!do e walk,dot talk rock!is tis place sucks,GO,BUT e joke, empty vessels make e most noise & guess, LL still stay what!i dot support many policy,BUT i dot think NS is all bad,depends how u see it,imagine a country without soldiers?so, are U ALL READY TO MOVE ALL YOUR FAMILY MEMBERS OUT, THEN GO!MAYBE TO CHINA,INDIA OR EVEN AFRICA CONTINENTS,OR BEST CAMBODIA,MAYBE EVEN RUSSIA...FREEDOM OF EVERYTHING YA.
Need to get moving -as aforementioned by "anonymous"- albeit in barely comprehensible fonts.
I'm currently under servitude. And NEED to move. Can't give two cents about family, finances, e.g. will figure it out on the road.
Is there any way to get out of this one? Eg. Overstay a visa in another country. America, UK(6 months) or Canada.
Though there is an apparent risk of deportation (due to overstaying) then jail when you're forced back here.
NS is a joke , a waste of time. Dudes 2 years ....witin that time period I could Half-way through college
refering to the comment by the brother above, about asking all of those who dont want ns to bug off, well bro, heres my point of view. we live in the 21st centuary, and there are many ways to instill DISCIPLINE, HONOUR, PUNCTUALITY and all those things. NS is outdated, u mentioned about 'A COUNTRY WITH NO SOLDERS'. well, then u just prooven our point. isnt NS supposed to be something to make u a better person and NOT A SOLDER? i mean, if it is, then why bother having other jobs in singapore, all the male borned there should be simply sent to military school instead of normal schools. in fact, why not just forget about NUS and all the bullshit and just make a DEFENCE UNIVERSITY since everybody is a SOLDIER weather they like it or not?! bro, seriously, use some intellengence. ns dosent gurantee u a job, a family, a future. NS is a game, played by the old man who didnt go through NS himself.
im sorry if anyone finds me offensive, but i myself am a singaporean, and i do not think it is acceptable for the government to take away 2 years of my life for nuts. 2 years man, i can achieve so much more outside, that i know for sure.
cheers, happy new year
I left Singapore when I was 16 years old. I am an national service deserter. Got my italian citizenship in 2000. Don't miss singapore at all. The only problem is that I will like to attend my mother's funeral one day.
The question is can I enter singapore with my italian passport as a tourist? Will I be arrested at the customs? I am not planning to move back to singapore just hoping that I can attend my mother's funeral that's all.
Or is it better to give up my singapore citizenship and holding just my italian nationality before entering Singapore?
If I dump my citizenship and come back on a foreign passport, on what jurisdiction does the Singapore government has to arrest me? Who gives them the right to arrest people that are not Singapore citizens, since the law only apply to Singapore citizens? Perhaps someone could clarify this? Can anyone please advise.
Ive lived in australia for about 14 yrs and during that time ive completed primary n secondary school education.... Im still on my parents visa and awaiting PR... i wanna reapply now because im aged 21 or even apply for another visa by being sponsered by my partner who is a citizen..... Problem is my passport has expired and i dnt have an identity card from singapore and i never went back to do NS...... what are my options to renew my passport now? Plz help .....!
if i apply for a police clearance cert will it imply that i'm a NS deserter?
WHAT HAPPENS IF I WANT TO GET MY POLICE CLEARANCE IF I AM A NS defaulter
To Singaporean who said
"WHAT HAPPENS IF I WANT TO GET MY POLICE CLEARANCE IF I AM A NS defaulter"
I do not know if Singapore will issue you a passport if you are a defaulter. You have to check with them. In Western countries your refusal to do national service for good reason, eg if you are a conscientous objector, is not considered bad moral character for immigration. Only serious criminal convictions are a bar.
Quote: "If I dump my citizenship and come back on a foreign passport, on what jurisdiction does the Singapore government has to arrest me? Who gives them the right to arrest people that are not Singapore citizens, since the law only apply to Singapore citizens? Perhaps someone could clarify this? Can anyone please advise. "
They are arresting you for a crime you committed while you were a citizen of their country. Their jurisdiction comes from the fact that you are in their country. Having said that, let's get a few things straight...
(1) You will not be made to serve NS. You can't be made to serve NS because you are now a foreign citizen and you no long hold allegiance to the state of Singapore.
(2) You can be fined up to $5,000 (which is no big deal) and/or jailed up to 3 years (which is a big deal).
(3) Having said that, unless you tell them that you are coming home (like the pianist did). There is a very good chance that they don't even know you are home when you return on a foreign passport. It is unlikely that they have your picture at the customs and if they try to match finger prints on everyone for everything that customs line is going to take days to clear -- so they don't. This is especially true if your name is completely different.
(4) If you are challenged and asked about having been a Singaporean at the customs. Just say "no". Just because your place of birth is "Singapore" doesn't mean you have ever been a Singaporean. If they say that their records show that you were, tell them that you don't know what they are talking about. If questioned further, ask to speak to your embassy's officer and refuse to answer any further questions. In fact, you won't actually be lying since you can claim that despite what they assert under their law, you have never ever agreed to Singaporean citizenship or pledged allegiance to Singapore, and their claim that you were a citizen is something you do no recognize or accept
(5) If you are actually arrested, try to post bail or if you are left unguarded escape from custody. Then, make your way to your country's embassy. They should be able to get you out of the country
To Anonymous who said,
"Who gives them the right to arrest people that are not Singapore citizens, since the law only apply to Singapore citizens? Perhaps someone could clarify this? Can anyone please advise. "
Singapore has the right to arrest and charge even foreigners who have failed to do national service. Your foreign citizenship does not protect you in this case.
This law is also applied in other countries. Turkey will arrest and detain Turkish citizens who have not done NS. But I understand they are quite lenient about it. Paying a fine and a short spell of service will release you from liability.
The only recourse for you is never to step foot into Singapore regardless of what citizenship you hold. You are safe as long as you do not enter Singapore. You cannot be extradited.
Very interesting post. I'm not clear why it is necessary to avoid national service but I did have a coffee with a neighbour from turkey and she mentioned that boys in her country do not fear National service. I then wrote an article on a possible solution which could be something to look at? http://singaporewritinghomemaker.blogspot.sg/2014/10/solution-to-national-service-in.html?m=1
To Singapore writing homemaker,
I wonder where you got the idea that I was suggesting that national service should be avoided! My article is written in simple enough English even for a housewife who stays at home and does the cooking.
As for your ideas on Turks national service, you seem to have a one sided view of one miserable neighbor from Turkey. For your information, from what I have heard from Turks living in California United States, they simply don't want to do any service and the government allows them to get away with a small fine plus about a week or so, where they do not do much more than showing you a rifle.
Hey. I completed NS (2 years) and about 5 high keys and a bunch of low key reservists.. then I skipped town and defaulted on my remaining conscription period. I have been living outside of singapore for the past 2 years now. I am not as fortunate as some to hold a 2nd passport of another nationality. My passport is inevitably going to expire one day but not yet. I am wondering if it is possible to be detained in any South east asian immigration control and extradited back to Singapore in this situation?
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